Ranking Sucks

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Ranking Sucks

Postby bananashakealchemist on Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:27 am

your ranking system is total garbage. after playing this game for more than 300h, i finally decided to give ranked a try.

the placement matches were a total joke. people wanted to giveup, after receiving ONE goal, even though there were still roughly 4 minutes of playtime left. i encountered the usual console plebs, that kept chasing the ball, and ignored everything else that has been going on in the match. they were literally standing next to each other, most of the time. some even left the game within the first two minutes, for absolutely no reason.

after disabling cross-network play, things got a bit better. i was placed in gold 3, and climbed up to plat. i thought things will get better now, but boy was i wrong. i constantly kept going from plat to gold, from gold to plat, untill i got an amazing streak of mentally challenged players.

i had a "goalie", that kept camping in front of the goal, even though the enemy wasnt even nearby. we constantly kept attacking, and there was no reason for him to just stand there and do nothing. the one time where we actually needed him to protect the goal, he decided to leave the goal wide open during kickoff, in order to get his boost. after telling him that he shouldnt camp, but rotate instead. he took it as an insult, and said he is gonna play for the enemy team now and make us lose (which he did). i reported him, but everyone knows that reporting someone, doesnt do anything. i see the very same toxic players over and over again.

in roughly 8 out of 10 matches, i had top score in my team. most of the time more than both of my allies combined, and even more than some of the enemy players, when we were losing. individual skill doesnt matter at all, with your garbage ranking system. no matter how good you are, and how bad your team is, you all get punished the same. so many games have been lost, even though we were leading 3-0, because gold/plat cancer doesnt know anything about formation and defending the goal, when you are in the lead. the greed takes over, and we lose at the end. as soon as we are in the lead, and i politely remind my team that we should play more defensive now, i get flamed to death.

this one time, my ally got disconnected in the first minute, and somehow we managed to win 2v3. did we get an appropriate reward for that struggle? no, because individual skill doesnt matter. once i had a player, who had 1.5h total playtime, and couldnt even hit a non-moving ball. why is this even allowed in ranked? why are you putting total beginners, with players of plat level? do you really have no common sense, about how a ranking system should be?

many competitive games have a pretty bad ranking system, but rocket league has the worst by far. and why do i have to play with a pre-made team? bad players create groups with other bad players, so instead of having one useless ally in my team, i get two.

if you want to improve the ranking system:

1) consider the total playtime. dont put players of 20h with players of 200h. dont even allow players of less than x hours, to play ranked.

2) dont put pre-made teams with and/or versus solo queue players. i dont want to play with crappy pre-made teams.

3) consider the overall points. dont punish and/or reward active players, the same amount as bad/inactive players.

4) give us a god damn ai, when a player leaves. having an ai player is better than having no player at all.

5) bring back neo tokyo. competitive games should balance around good players, and not around whiny little noobs.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby N7Mith on Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:30 am

You start out at the very bottom, which is the central hub for those kind of players. Until you climb out of there by proving you don't belong there, that's the kind of matches you'll get.

Fortunately for you, you have the option to find good teammates and play together.

1. Time doesn't mean much, and would be a very bad way to determine matchmaking.
2. Play solo standard, or team up yourself.
3. That would result in more ballchasing.
4. No opinion.
5. Yes please, but it's not going to happen.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby Tentacles on Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:28 pm

Ai gets in the way, so that's a no for me.

But as for #3 if implemented properly that would fix matchmaking and stop ball chasing.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby bananashakealchemist on Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:49 am

@N7Mith
1. Time doesn't mean much, and would be a very bad way to determine matchmaking.
- so its better to allow players with 1.5h playtime to do ranked? i agree that time doesnt equal skill, but thats not the point. low playtime players should simply not be able to do ranked. in many mobas you have to earn the right do ranked. in rocket league, players with low playtime are either beginners, trolls, or smurfs. considering the playtime, would tone it down.

2. Play solo standard, or team up yourself.
- teams should not be put together with solo queues. no matter what mode i choose to play, solo queues and team queues should be two different branches, like in some competitive rts games. make mixed player modes optional, and dont just force it on everyone.

3. That would result in more ballchasing.
- touching the ball doesnt necessarily give you points. you get points by doing something useful. ball chasing will make you lose, no matter how many, or how little points you get. some people will never learn from their mistakes, but those players will never advance either way. yesterday i had a loss, where i had ~510pt, ally nr.1 had ~100pt, and ally nr.2 20pt. why do i get punished the same, when i was the one who carried the whole god damn team?

im so sick and tired of this crappy game. also doesnt help that i got the same noob 4 times in a row, or russians with a 400ms ping, that make everyone lag. from all the competitive games i played so far, RL players are by far the most r******* ones. all they care about, is touching the ball. no matter how little sense it makes from that angle. instead of letting the ally shoot, because he is already there, and has a much better angle anyway, they feel the need to rush, hit blindly, and in the end give the enemy a great opportunity to score. they constantly keep passing the ball to the enemy, and serve them a freebie on a silver plate. the saddest part is, that 7 out of 10 games i usually lose, we were in a lead by at least 1-2 goals from pretty early on. but no, RL players HAVE TO win with a lead of at least 5 goals. they rather lose the whole game, than accepting a 1-0 win. and when they are losing 1-7, they are way too proud to simply give up. instead they waste everyones time. pathetic.

i will probably stop playing this game, until psyonix greatly changes the whole ranking system. i doubt they ever will however. but whatever, then i will have at least more free time to play other games. a lot of good games are coming out this year. so thats fine by me.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby zGreenMachine- on Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:19 am

Yes to bringing back Neo Tokyo

I was once a console pleb :\ now I am #LEETPCMASTERRACE4LIFE

solo-queue at your own risk. for me at least it doesn't feel any different than queuing with friends
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby Scyonite on Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:55 am

bananashakealchemist wrote:@N7Mith
3. That would result in more ballchasing.
- touching the ball doesnt necessarily give you points. you get points by doing something useful. ball chasing will make you lose, no matter how many, or how little points you get. some people will never learn from their mistakes, but those players will never advance either way. yesterday i had a loss, where i had ~510pt, ally nr.1 had ~100pt, and ally nr.2 20pt. why do i get punished the same, when i was the one who carried the whole god damn team?


Wait a minute, you go on about saying ball chasing is bad and then you talk badly about teammates in a game in which you've likely chased the ball? Score says nothing about the importance of a player. A player that knows where to be at exactly the right time and rotates at the right time is way more valuable than someone that takes every opportunity to score points and be "important".
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby bananashakealchemist on Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:12 am

@Scyonite
your assumption is wrong. when i see an ally near the ball, i dont go there. whats the point in having two players standing at the same position? i need allies who know basic formation, and how to pass, or do a followup. having 0-80pt shows very well how unimportant you were during the whole match. when i need to attack, i attack. when i need to defend, i defend. thats why i get all kinds of "rewards" and have the highest score most of the time. the majority of players doesnt know how to rotate. usually both of my allies chase the ball blindly, and ignore everything else that is going on. they stand literally next to each other, and by the end of the match, the score perfectly reflects their playstyle. how come that players who know how to rotate, and when to switch from offensive to defensive mode, have way more points than players who dont know? i dont do stuff for points. i do what needs to be done. points are just a side-effect. gold is pure cancer. they dont know anything about this game. they are insanly inaccurate, and totally allergic to any sort of plan or feedback. we are leading 3-0, and when i politely say something like "hey lets play more defensive now", my allies reply with "stfu noob. your mom is a *****". the worst kind of players are all those gold masters, and legends, and whatnot. spent a gazillion hours playing this game, but havent learned one damn thing about teamplay.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby Scyonite on Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:29 am

Score represents actions done by the player in the way the game sums up the importance to psyonix' standards. It does not necessarily or accurately reflect the most important player in a match. You can't say you were important because you had 10 aerial hits (all gotten in airdrags that failed), 5 clears that were never any danger to begin with and 6 shots that just were no challenge to the opponent team at all. This is an extreme version of what I mean, but any pro player will agree with the point I'm trying to convey. Although I would agree gold players just don't understand the game that well yet, but hey, it might be they've just started with this game.

If you feel you know more than your teammates in every single match you play and your MMR doesn't rise you should save matches and view them from your teammates' perspectives and try to look at how your choices affect their choices. There's much to learn from looking at replays.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby bo0sted_mkiv on Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:10 pm

Scyonite wrote:Score represents actions done by the player in the way the game sums up the importance to psyonix' standards. It does not necessarily or accurately reflect the most important player in a match. You can't say you were important because you had 10 aerial hits (all gotten in airdrags that failed), 5 clears that were never any danger to begin with and 6 shots that just were no challenge to the opponent team at all. This is an extreme version of what I mean, but any pro player will agree with the point I'm trying to convey. Although I would agree gold players just don't understand the game that well yet, but hey, it might be they've just started with this game.

If you feel you know more than your teammates in every single match you play and your MMR doesn't rise you should save matches and view them from your teammates' perspectives and try to look at how your choices affect their choices. There's much to learn from looking at replays.




I completely agree to watching my own replays, I do that probably 2 times a week and I see tons of mistakes on my end when I should of trusted my TM to make the hit instead of me thinking to hit it. Also it shows you what to work on. I used to be STUCK at Gold 3 Division III and IV for probably 300 games, got frustrated. Started watching my replays and making adjustments and I'm stuck between Plat 1 Division IV (on bad days) - Plat 2 Division IV but I keep seeing more tweaks to be made
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby AlexCuse44 on Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:34 pm

I would like to add a couple things. First of all you're a bit arrogant and with 300 hours you have VERY much to learn. 300 hours typically isn't enough for most to have the basics mastered. Another thing is that everyone is in the same ranking system. We all have bad teammates and feel that we "carry" others but if you actually were good enough to get out of the rank then you would. You also talk about how they don't understand team play at gold level which is very understandable. From my understanding gold/plat is more about not making mistakes and capitalizing on the opponents mistakes to win. You won't see passing usually in even diamond level of play. You need to learn to play with your opponents at any level. For example if they ball chase the whole time, recognize it and play more defensive.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby bananashakealchemist on Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:56 am

@AlexCuse44
with 300 hours you have VERY much to learn. 300 hours typically isn't enough for most to have the basics mastered.
- some players have 1000h, and are nowhere near as good as someone who only has 50h. everyone is different. you dont need a lot of time to fully understand the game mechanics/physics. you can easily do it in 10-30h. everything after that, is just car/ball control and movement/jumping practice. and that number is different for every player. you cant generalize that.

Another thing is that everyone is in the same ranking system.
- yes, i just want psyionix to consider personal skill more, instead of rewarding/punishing everyone the same.

if you actually were good enough to get out of the rank then you would.
- its impossible to win with players, who refuse to play team. no matter how good you are, you will never win with 2 players that are literally standing next to each other all the time. especially pre-made teams like to 69 the whole match. as soon as you say "dont chase ball pls" or "rotate pls" you get a "no" or a "lol f*** you noob". gold/plat players dont want to win 1-0, they either want to win 7-0, or not win at all. as soon as we are in the lead, instead of playing more defensive, they start playing even more offensive. so i try to defend as much as possible, but then they see oh good that guy defends the goal, so we can both charge like idiots now. im not a bad keeper, but i cannot defend against 3 overly aggressive players, that have nothing to lose. i get screwed over by my own team, that simply doesnt want to rotate, and ignores every request or feedback.

From my understanding gold/plat is more about not making mistakes and capitalizing on the opponents mistakes to win.
- i think thats true for every rank.

You need to learn to play with your opponents at any level. For example if they ball chase the whole time, recognize it and play more defensive.
- why do you think i have top score almost every game? i adapt to the situation and defend when its necessary, and attack when there is an opportunity. most of the time that opportunity gets ruined however, by an ally who feels the need to kick the ball to the side, instead of letting me shoot, while i still have a perfectly clear view at an empty goal. gold/plat players just want to touch the ball. no matter how little sense it makes, from that angle. like i said, when i see an ally near the ball, i dont even go there. i keep a distance, so i can do a followup or whatever. but im not concerned about scoring goals. im more concerned about the fact that no gold/plat player knows how to defend, or at least keep a basic formation. i can compensate for one stupid ally, but not for two. i cannot be at 3 places at once.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby N7Mith on Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:42 am

bananashakealchemist wrote:@AlexCuse44
with 300 hours you have VERY much to learn. 300 hours typically isn't enough for most to have the basics mastered.
- some players have 1000h, and are nowhere near as good as someone who only has 50h. everyone is different. you dont need a lot of time to fully understand the game mechanics/physics. you can easily do it in 10-30h. everything after that, is just car/ball control and movement/jumping practice. and that number is different for every player. you cant generalize that.

Another thing is that everyone is in the same ranking system.
- yes, i just want psyionix to consider personal skill more, instead of rewarding/punishing everyone the same.

if you actually were good enough to get out of the rank then you would.
- its impossible to win with players, who refuse to play team. no matter how good you are, you will never win with 2 players that are literally standing next to each other all the time. especially pre-made teams like to 69 the whole match. as soon as you say "dont chase ball pls" or "rotate pls" you get a "no" or a "lol f*** you noob". gold/plat players dont want to win 1-0, they either want to win 7-0, or not win at all. as soon as we are in the lead, instead of playing more defensive, they start playing even more offensive. so i try to defend as much as possible, but then they see oh good that guy defends the goal, so we can both charge like idiots now. im not a bad keeper, but i cannot defend against 3 overly aggressive players, that have nothing to lose. i get screwed over by my own team, that simply doesnt want to rotate, and ignores every request or feedback.

From my understanding gold/plat is more about not making mistakes and capitalizing on the opponents mistakes to win.
- i think thats true for every rank.

8-) I was just like you after my 300h. You have a couple eye-openers waiting for you ;) :P
It sounds like you score so high because you result to chasing when you feel like you can't trust your teammates. Try to just keep your goal save, and wait for good counters.
Idk if you let them know (with chat or quickchats) when you don't like their performance, but that usually has the opposite effect. Lying "no problem" works way better.
Also there are 5 players in a match besides you, so your team has spots for 2 bad players but your opponents' 3. So overall it works in your advantage. You can really tilt it by teaming up with friends (or randoms you played well with), ensuring these players never get in your team.
Bronze is more about hitting the ball than not making mistakes. Screwups usually don't get punished because players aren't adept enough to follow up on them.
Everybody learns differently, true, but nobody masters the game in 300 hours. So give up your ego and accept you still have a lot to learn.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby bananashakealchemist on Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:43 am

@N7Mith
like i explained earlier, i score "high" because i attack when i have the opportunity to score, and i defend when i need to. i adapt to the situation and calculate the risks of my actions. my score is a mixture of goals, passes, and saves. you dont score 500+ points (which isnt even that high) by simply being the first during kickoff. if i were chasing the ball like my allies do, i would be bronze by now.

also who said anything about mastering the game? my issue is about teamplay, and not about who can do the sickest areals or whatever.

here is what annoys me the most about gold/plat:
- frontline gets boost during kickoff, instead of kicking the ball.
- backline gets boost during kickoff, instead of protecting the goal.
- backline charges to attack during kickoff, instead of protecting the goal.
- absolutely no formation. both players chase the ball and stand next to each other the whole match.
- when they have a lead, they play even more aggressive, and lose in the end.
- no matter what you write and how polite you are, it will be ignored and you get insulted. its best to simply disable the whole chat.
- instead of letting someone with a better angle shoot, they feel the need to kick the ball away from you, and ruin your chance.
- zero map awarness. all they see is the ball, and nothing else. they dont care wether someone defends the goal or not.
- constantly bumping into teammates. if they cant score, they make sure that you cant score either.
- inaccurate players. even when the ball isnt moving, they have trouble shooting a straight line.
- no sense of power. they dont know how strong they have to hit the ball to score. they always shoot over the top.

obviously players like that will never change. especially when they played the game the wrong way for 1000h. i dont mind losing, if the enemy team played better, which 95% of the time wasnt the case sadly enough. we lost because both of my allies started hugging each other, after having a 2-3 point lead. no matter what i do, it wont be enough to compensate for so much stupidity.

all im asking psyonix to do is, introduce a better ranking system, where good players get rewarded more, and punished less than useless players. it works for mobas, why shouldnt it work here? it would be best if the whole point system were hidden in ranked mode however. the player with the lowest score gets usually flamed to death, and its really disgusting.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby Scyonite on Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:04 am

I think the issue with a more personalized MMR system is that evaluating a person's performance will always be subject to subjectivity and in that regard people will always disagree with a new system Psyonix might introduce. Also, that will encourage players to perform in every single match and it will devalue teamplay in a sense. In a game like this I highly derecommend individual performance being used for MMR. You make or break your team and your ability to adapt to your teammates' abilities is highly reflected in MMR now, as it should be.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby N7Mith on Sat Jan 13, 2018 9:23 am

bananashakealchemist wrote:@N7Mith
like i explained earlier, i score "high" because i attack when i have the opportunity to score, and i defend when i need to. i adapt to the situation and calculate the risks of my actions. my score is a mixture of goals, passes, and saves. you dont score 500+ points (which isnt even that high) by simply being the first during kickoff. if i were chasing the ball like my allies do, i would be bronze by now.

also who said anything about mastering the game? my issue is about teamplay, and not about who can do the sickest areals or whatever.

Ah my bad. I thought this topic was about climbing out of bronze. I missed the 'got to plat part'.

With random teammates communication is tough. A 'rotate pls?' often (not always unfortunately) works. I have to be reminded every now and then too. I also feel most teammates adjust to one player keeping solid rotations. And good passes can steer your teammates into rotating.
As for the rest; everyone has bad games. Gold/plat/diamond are full of players being ranked on their A-games, then keep on trying to get back in the zone when they shouldn't. It's impossible to see if someone doesn't belong in a rank based on 1 or 2 games.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby Mantus on Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:29 pm

bananashakealchemist wrote:@N7Mith
like i explained earlier, i score "high" because i attack when i have the opportunity to score, and i defend when i need to. i adapt to the situation and calculate the risks of my actions. my score is a mixture of goals, passes, and saves. you dont score 500+ points (which isnt even that high) by simply being the first during kickoff. if i were chasing the ball like my allies do, i would be bronze by now.

also who said anything about mastering the game? my issue is about teamplay, and not about who can do the sickest areals or whatever.

here is what annoys me the most about gold/plat:
- frontline gets boost during kickoff, instead of kicking the ball.
- backline gets boost during kickoff, instead of protecting the goal.
- backline charges to attack during kickoff, instead of protecting the goal.
- absolutely no formation. both players chase the ball and stand next to each other the whole match.
- when they have a lead, they play even more aggressive, and lose in the end.
- no matter what you write and how polite you are, it will be ignored and you get insulted. its best to simply disable the whole chat.
- instead of letting someone with a better angle shoot, they feel the need to kick the ball away from you, and ruin your chance.
- zero map awarness. all they see is the ball, and nothing else. they dont care wether someone defends the goal or not.
- constantly bumping into teammates. if they cant score, they make sure that you cant score either.
- inaccurate players. even when the ball isnt moving, they have trouble shooting a straight line.
- no sense of power. they dont know how strong they have to hit the ball to score. they always shoot over the top.

obviously players like that will never change. especially when they played the game the wrong way for 1000h. i dont mind losing, if the enemy team played better, which 95% of the time wasnt the case sadly enough. we lost because both of my allies started hugging each other, after having a 2-3 point lead. no matter what i do, it wont be enough to compensate for so much stupidity.

all im asking psyonix to do is, introduce a better ranking system, where good players get rewarded more, and punished less than useless players. it works for mobas, why shouldnt it work here? it would be best if the whole point system were hidden in ranked mode however. the player with the lowest score gets usually flamed to death, and its really disgusting.


I don't agree with you. Ball chasers score the most a lot. Not understanding that shows that you really don't understand at all. Not having the slightest clue why a player can end up with 0-80 points also shows you don't understand. If it is not you cutting someone out of position it could be the next guy. I had low scoring day just today. Teamed with the same ball chaser over and over. Any time I had anything a clear, a shot, a save.. this guy was hitting it sideways. Didn't matter if it hit the wall and landed in a perfect center for the other team.. HE score POINTS like a pro.. Which you come off very much sounding like. You know what happens when you a cut a teammate out of the game for 2-3 minutes? He starts forcing himself into the game. You might not be one doing it, but not realizing how it happens makes me believe you are.

The fact that you think scoring the most points, not goals, should be a ranking qualifier shows you don't understand what it's like to be cut out of rotation. The fact that you can't understand how a player scores low, shows that you don't understand how 1 chaser can ruin a game for 1 teammate. Which since you don't understand makes me believe you haven't experienced the piths and scorn of a person that rotates properly because you're a ball chaser that unfortunately Im stuck in the same ranks as. The quicksand.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby Scyonite on Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:41 pm

Mantus wrote:
bananashakealchemist wrote:@N7Mith
like i explained earlier, i score "high" because i attack when i have the opportunity to score, and i defend when i need to. i adapt to the situation and calculate the risks of my actions. my score is a mixture of goals, passes, and saves. you dont score 500+ points (which isnt even that high) by simply being the first during kickoff. if i were chasing the ball like my allies do, i would be bronze by now.

also who said anything about mastering the game? my issue is about teamplay, and not about who can do the sickest areals or whatever.

here is what annoys me the most about gold/plat:
- frontline gets boost during kickoff, instead of kicking the ball.
- backline gets boost during kickoff, instead of protecting the goal.
- backline charges to attack during kickoff, instead of protecting the goal.
- absolutely no formation. both players chase the ball and stand next to each other the whole match.
- when they have a lead, they play even more aggressive, and lose in the end.
- no matter what you write and how polite you are, it will be ignored and you get insulted. its best to simply disable the whole chat.
- instead of letting someone with a better angle shoot, they feel the need to kick the ball away from you, and ruin your chance.
- zero map awarness. all they see is the ball, and nothing else. they dont care wether someone defends the goal or not.
- constantly bumping into teammates. if they cant score, they make sure that you cant score either.
- inaccurate players. even when the ball isnt moving, they have trouble shooting a straight line.
- no sense of power. they dont know how strong they have to hit the ball to score. they always shoot over the top.

obviously players like that will never change. especially when they played the game the wrong way for 1000h. i dont mind losing, if the enemy team played better, which 95% of the time wasnt the case sadly enough. we lost because both of my allies started hugging each other, after having a 2-3 point lead. no matter what i do, it wont be enough to compensate for so much stupidity.

all im asking psyonix to do is, introduce a better ranking system, where good players get rewarded more, and punished less than useless players. it works for mobas, why shouldnt it work here? it would be best if the whole point system were hidden in ranked mode however. the player with the lowest score gets usually flamed to death, and its really disgusting.


I don't agree with you. Ball chasers score the most a lot. Not understanding that shows that you really don't understand at all. Not having the slightest clue why a player can end up with 0-80 points also shows you don't understand. If it is not you cutting someone out of position it could be the next guy. I had low scoring day just today. Teamed with the same ball chaser over and over. Any time I had anything a clear, a shot, a save.. this guy was hitting it sideways. Didn't matter if it hit the wall and landed in a perfect center for the other team.. HE score POINTS like a pro.. Which you come off very much sounding like. You know what happens when you a cut a teammate out of the game for 2-3 minutes? He starts forcing himself into the game. You might not be one doing it, but not realizing how it happens makes me believe you are.

The fact that you think scoring the most points, not goals, should be a ranking qualifier shows you don't understand what it's like to be cut out of rotation. The fact that you can't understand how a player scores low, shows that you don't understand how 1 chaser can ruin a game for 1 teammate. Which since you don't understand makes me believe you haven't experienced the piths and scorn of a person that rotates properly because you're a ball chaser that unfortunately Im stuck in the same ranks as. The quicksand.


I've been in here trying to convey the exact point you make, albeit with less words and more specifically trying to incline the OP to watch replays. I gave up lel. He shows he doesn't want to understand. OP, you've just got some stuff to learn still. Every single player has stuff to learn still and if they don't realize they do, they will never improve. At least not in a team sense. (Meaning mechanically, yes you will improve by just playing.)
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby N7Mith on Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:18 am

Mantus wrote:The fact that you think scoring the most points, not goals, should be a ranking qualifier shows you don't understand what it's like to be cut out of rotation. The fact that you can't understand how a player scores low, shows that you don't understand how 1 chaser can ruin a game for 1 teammate. Which since you don't understand makes me believe you haven't experienced the piths and scorn of a person that rotates properly because you're a ball chaser that unfortunately Im stuck in the same ranks as. The quicksand.

Precisely.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby bananashakealchemist on Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:26 am

@Mantus
ball chasers rarely do anything useful. randomly touching the ball doesnt give you points. scoring or defending the goal does. if you rotate properly, you wont end up having 80pt. if you camp, you will. people who cut you off, are doomed to lose the game. no matter how often they touch the ball, unless they actually score (and they usually dont) they wont have a meaningful score anyway.

in mobas you get extra credit for being the mvp. for having lots of kills or assists, and little deaths. and it works very well. RL could implement a similar system. people with more points will level a bit faster, than people with little points. oh but then everyone will chase the ball blah blah. so what? they will lose more often if they do. this game is about tactics. about finding the balance. you either understand this game, and play as a freaking team, that keeps a solid formation, or you dont.

and fyi, i usually play passive. if my allies chase the ball 24/7 and never rotate, im totally fine being the backline. but even when i play the backline for the whole match, i still manage to have a higher score than both of my allies combined. by your logic, the ballchasers should have a higher score than me, but they dont. why? because quality > quantity. ball chasers usually dont score. i can spend the whole match in the back, and still be the mvp. all i need is a opportunity. a enemy mistake i can exploit with a longshot. you have to be aware of the map and adapt to the current situation. ball chasers arent aware of anything other than the ball. thats why they have no goals. thats why they have little points. thats why they lose the match.

@Scyonite
who said that i didnt watch my replays? one thing does not rule out the other. in fact, i already know during the match, where i screwed up, and where i need to improve in the future. but like i said, this has nothing to do with personal skill or whatever, but with the lack of basic teamplay.
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Re: Ranking Sucks

Postby Scyonite on Wed Jan 17, 2018 5:39 am

bananashakealchemist wrote:@Mantus
ball chasers rarely do anything useful. randomly touching the ball doesnt give you points. scoring or defending the goal does. if you rotate properly, you wont end up having 80pt. if you camp, you will. people who cut you off, are doomed to lose the game. no matter how often they touch the ball, unless they actually score (and they usually dont) they wont have a meaningful score anyway.


You don't seem to understand some people generally cut off a lot without ever realizing they do just that. For them it seems like their teammate is being too passive. Unless this player recognizes that the teammate has better angles they will never get out of that MMR, in which too many individual players simply want to be the superstar of the match. (This continues for a big remainder of platinum, in diamond these people are weeded out mostly.) To all of us here it sounds like you are the one that focuses on the ball too much, and then blame the teammates for not helping out, at which point they should not help out, because you're still at the damn ball. It might be less obvious in contrast to a real ballchaser, but believe me your posts here are in line with how these people think.

bananashakealchemist wrote:in mobas you get extra credit for being the mvp. for having lots of kills or assists, and little deaths. and it works very well. RL could implement a similar system. people with more points will level a bit faster, than people with little points. oh but then everyone will chase the ball blah blah. so what? they will lose more often if they do. this game is about tactics. about finding the balance. you either understand this game, and play as a freaking team, that keeps a solid formation, or you dont.


I don't believe that, in this regard, Rocket League can be this closely compared with mobas. Killing another person, getting money and robbing them of valuable, playable seconds are hard gains; there's close to no discussion possible over choosing not to kill or choosing to be killed, other than very tactical and intentional actions by players that understand that game to its core. That's why an MVP in a moba is very likely to actually be the most valuable player/person. In Rocket League, however, not a lot of actions can be regarded as close to always being beneficial; a shot on goal might just be too easy to read and give away possession. A first touch, a demo, a center ball could all receive the same note. Hard gains like goals and saves are more likely to more represent a true value of how valuable a player was, but even in 1v1 scoring is not always the smartest move as you just might give away possession at the next kickoff, while already being ahead in score. Rocket League would have to strip a lot of ways to get points at this stage and focus more on goals and saves. But I'm not exactly sure that's a good thing to do.

bananashakealchemist wrote:@Scyonite
who said that i didnt watch my replays? one thing does not rule out the other. in fact, i already know during the match, where i screwed up, and where i need to improve in the future. but like i said, this has nothing to do with personal skill or whatever, but with the lack of basic teamplay.


It sounds to us that where you really need to improve is your adaptability to other players (yes, even more), even though they might have to too. If you really are as good as you think you are, you eventually get out of this elo. But apparently you aren't. Stop putting yourself on a pedestal.
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